When “Hacks” began three seasons ago, young writer Ava Daniels, played by young comedian Hannah Einbinder, was a precocious if cocky talent, reluctantly paired with veteran diva comedian Deborah Vance (Jean Smart). Their prickly collaboration brought out the best in both of their work. By the time the second season ended, Deborah’s career had reached new heights — and then she fired Ava to force her to strike out on her own. But these two can’t leave each other alone, as Season 3 proves. (Spoilers ahead.)
Einbinder was new to acting when she began playing Ava, but she embraced the role instantly (she'd now earned an Emmy nomination for each season), giving her character some of the absurd depth her comedy offers.
Between seasons, Einbinder returned to the road as a stand-up comedian; his first special, “Everything Must Go,” premiered on Max in June. And while he wrote most of the material before “Hacks” began, “the time I spent acting helped me lean into the theatricality of my special that has been inherent to my comedic style,” he says via video chat. “My ability to commit to bigger acting decisions is a result of the fact that I’ve learned how to act in a real way.”
She notes that when she began playing the role, “Ava was fully formed and there was a lot to work with, and I think as the years have gone by I’ve found ways to bring more texture to a character that’s already so detailed.” Below, Einbinder breaks down some key moments from Season 3 that highlight the changes in Ava and her relationship with Deborah, for better or worse.
In the first episode, we learn that Deborah has cut off all communication, which has so obsessed Ava that she's had to go to couples therapy with her girlfriend, Ruby. She even gets into a car accident because she gets distracted by Deborah's poster, and then lies to Ruby about the accident. “That's the kind of thing a person is forced to do when they're so in love,” Einbinder says. “Ava's sense of morality goes out the window when it comes to Deborah, whether it's protecting her, getting back together, anything, so that flippant, white lie is indicative of the fact that that's a relationship she has to hide.”
Hannah Einbinder, left, and Jean Smart in “Hacks.”
(Jake Giles Netter / Max)
Later, Ava meets up with Deborah and finally breaks down as she confronts her about excluding her from her life. “I think Ava is at a point where she’s acting impulsively and it’s a very vulnerable point, where she doesn’t just get out of the elevator to go confront Deborah, but she ends up staying in the room to drink with her, and the two of them laugh, and she caves and betrays herself and any progress she’s made, just to get another dose of this toxic, exciting relationship,” Einbinder says. “To me, that put her in a very vulnerable spot, and I think that’s why that reaction happened.”
When Deborah learns she hasn’t landed her dream job, hosting “Late Night,” she and Ava are in the middle of a golf tournament. Driving their golf cart, Ava wants to think about next steps, but Deborah doesn’t want to talk about it. The ride becomes silent, but their faces belie the movement underneath. “That’s a moment that really shows the power imbalance and how much more committed Ava is to Deborah than Deborah is to Ava,” Einbinder says. “And also, I think they take turns being mature — it’s rare that they’re mature at the same time, so that would be an example of Ava saying, ‘Let’s keep going,’ and Deborah saying, ‘No, it’s over,’ giving up.”
“I’ve worked a lot in my personal life on not hating myself and being really incredibly self-deprecating — the classic comedian archetype, obviously,” says Hannah Einbinder.
(Christina House/Los Angeles Times)
In the finale, when Deborah has already landed the job, she offers Ava the head writer position, but Ava declines out of fear and lies about why. When Ava finds out about the betrayal, she blackmails Deborah into giving her the job. It’s the craziest leap Ava has made yet. “When I read the scene at the beginning, it seemed very clear to me that the performance was going to reference a lot of the villains I love and a lot of the mob movies I’ve seen,” says Einbinder. “I think Ava is forced to act this way. It’s not necessarily a change in her persona; it’s something she has no choice but to do.” And Deborah would have done no less.
Einbinder's final reflection is not about the role, but about his third Emmy nomination. “It feels different [from the previous two]“Because I will say that I’ve done a lot of work in my personal life on not hating myself and being really incredibly self-deprecating — the classic stand-up comedian archetype, obviously — but I’ve really committed myself to it this year. I was sick of that and I did a lot of work on being okay with myself, and that’s allowed me to feel proud in a way that I didn’t allow myself before. It’s a relief.”
